Buying a Boat Guide |
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I Want to Buy a Boat! |
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Having just woken
up this morning, you looked out at the clear blue sky, and said to
yourself, "A boat would be nice". Yes, boats are great. No traffic
lights, huge open spaces, fresh air and sun, just kicking back and
enjoying your hard earned time off.
For most of us buying a boat represents the realization of a dream,
and perhaps a new beginning. By ensuring that you take certain steps
it will be an enjoyable pastime or lifestyle which will give you and
your family a lot of pleasurable moments - and the not so enjoyable
ones will make great pub or dinner stories - the waves always get
bigger and bigger!
These notes are not intended to be the a-z of boat buying, just a
few notes to give you some impartial help, and to highlight some important
points. I have tried to give you some guidance on what to consider
when deciding if the boat you are looking at is going to give the
surveyor writer's cramp. Therefore, there are some areas I have
highlighted with regard to condition/maintenance.
However, I am not a surveyor but when looking at boats, you will have
to assess their condition before you make an offer. This guide should
give you some pointers. The guide's main purpose is to explain the
boat buying process and the factors, which can determine the type
of boat you eventually buy.
Over time I have realized how often, we in the boating industry, take
it for granted that potential clients come down fully armed with their
definitions of boating terms.
Bow, stern, port, starboard, keel, and beam, are not words used in
everyday conversation - unless you enjoy drinking on your own!
What should be a pleasurable experience can become confusing and frustrating.
To avoid turning a dream into a logistical nightmare take the time
to read these notes.
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Information from Magazines
& Internet Sites |
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First of all, you
probably don’t know that much about the different makes of boats.
Holden's, Fords, etc, we all know what they look like - but what does
the inside of a 27’ Northshore look like, or how much space is there
inside a 28’ Bertram. So where do you start?
Well, you can begin by visiting our web site of course @ www.sydneyboats.com.au
The most popular major monthly national boating magazine is Trade-A-Boat
lists all the boats that are currently advertised for sale, as does
their website, Boat
Point.
For yachties I would also recommend 'Cruising Helmsman' which comes
out monthly. This magazine is dedicated to yachting, and contains
excellent articles about yachts, tests and services.
Another excellent publication is ‘Sydney Afloat" this is a free publication
which comes out monthly, and can be obtained from most marinas, and
boat accessory shops. It is a general publication with articles, services,
and boating information of a general nature.
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Done the Reading, Now for
the Real Thing! |
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So where do you go
to buy a boat? If you want to buy a used boat you can either visit
a boat broker or buy a boat privately. The majority of brokers are
based at marinas.
How do you find a boat broker?
Boat Brokers are usually experienced boaties. The majority of us are
members of the Boating Industry Association, within which there is
the Marine Brokers Association of NSW. We follow approved guidelines,
have a code of ethics, and are audited once a year by the Boating
Industry Association. Be wary of buying a boat from a broker who does
not appear to be experienced in the type of boat you may be buying,
as he may not give you the correct advice.
You will also find all the brokers advertising in the Trade-a-Boat
magazine and on
http://www.boatpoint.com.au
Logistically, buying a boat is much harder than buying any other type
of purchase, except perhaps a submarine, a house in Outer Mongolia,
or a pink elephant that speaks 3 languages. This is because boating
has a natural element, which changes quickly (tides and winds), and
the industry is quite small which does not allow for large staff numbers.
So it is not always possible to give Macdonald’s type instant service.
The only reason I emphasise this is so that you do not rush out buy
a boat only to come away disillusioned. It is not because we are not
interested - we are. However, on sunny days it sometimes appears as
if everybody wants to buy a boat at the same time. On a sunny day
who can blame you!
Boat brokers normally work by appointment, as many of their boats
will be on the owner’s moorings, up and down the river, harbour, etc.
NOTE: A mooring is a block of concrete on the riverbed to which
a length of chain is attached to which the boat is tied to. A berth
is a floating fixture at a marina to which the boat is tied alongside.
To save yourself a wasted journey, call first and make an
appointment.
Therefore, you need the time to get out to the boat you want to look
at. The broker will take you there in his own boat. A little patience
is a necessity. Come dressed to look at boats; high heels are
not a good idea, neither is a dinner jacket. We are limited to how
many people can be taken out at one time. We do not take out very
young children; the wash from passing boats at weekends can cause
a lot of movement on boats, this can be potentially dangerous (we
were recently expected to take out a 3 month old baby complete with
pram - not a good idea!).
The best thing to do is ring
the broker first and have a chat to him or her, about what it is you
are looking for in a boat.
I cannot see the point in rushing out to look at just one boat. Treat
it as a learning experience and take the time to listen to the broker.
Qualified Brokers will not normally give you the ‘hard sell’. They
will show you a boat, describe its uses, and perhaps explain to you
that a round the world dream is not too sensible in a 24 foot yacht
that have never seen the entrance to Sydney harbour. We love boating,
and most brokers have a natural passion for boating. They will give
you good advice, even though you may not end up buying a boat from
him or her.
So after much use of the Gregory's you finally
find the broker!
Marinas have been around for a long-time, but recent housing development
means they are usually tightly hemmed in. Be prepared for parking
difficulties.
At the Marina, instead of finding a suit garmented smiling individual
with a tie, and mirror finish shoes, you may find the office deserted.
He is probably out on the water still struggling to get a potential
client and his family, neighbours and the mate who knows everything
off a boat, which is swinging widely about on its mooring. So a 9.00
a.m. appointment may mean 9.15. Tides, winds etc do not run to exact
timetables so be prepared for delays.
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Types of Boats |
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So you want a
boat.. But what type?
To enjoy your boating, first decide what it is you are going to do
with the boat, and then look for a boat to match. Yacht, ketch, sloop
rig, flybridge cruiser, that big white one you saw on TV last night
– what sort of boat do you want?
The first definition is Power or Sail. Power for those
of you that do not want to be relying on the wind, with ropes and
sails flying about. Sail for those of you who want the excitement
of mastering the wind and dream about sailing the seven seas.
Your budget, length of boat, its use, age, style are of course other
important considerations. The table I have complied is a short summary
of the various design types and their common uses. It is by no means
all-inclusive but it will give you some ideas. I have also added some
common makes so you can look them up on
www.boatpoint.com.au. |
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| Type |
Suitability |
Some Examples |
YACHT - sloop rig
Aft cockpit/Centre cockpit |
Most common rig -
suits all purposes. |
Dufour,Northshore, Compass, Bavaria, Roberts,
Beneteau, Eastcoast, Jarkan, Mottle |
| YACHT- ketch rig |
More suited for off - shore cruising |
Duncanson, Spray, Roberts,
Pugh |
| CATAMARANS - SAIL |
Cruising/Charter |
Crowther, Seawind |
| FLYBRIDGE CRUISER |
Recreational/Fishing & off-shore |
Mariner, Bertram, Riviera, Cranchi, Silverton,
Fairline. |
| SEDAN/Displacement |
Recreational Cruising(9 knots)
|
Mariner, Roberts, Cunard, Steber,
Clipper, Seacrest. |
| SPORTS CRUISER |
Mostly sheltered waters, ok for outside when
swell is manageable. |
Searay, Bayliner, Regal, Wellcraft, Scarab,
Cranchi. |
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Note: Displacement means a vessel, which normally has a single engine
(occasionally 2), and can do a maximum of 9-12 knots. It is designed
to push through water rather than semi-plane.
A displacement vessel is generally more stable at low speeds than
a planing vessel.
Plane is where the thrust from the propellers pushes the bow out of
the water causing less resistance and hence more speed.
Boats come in all shapes and sizes - just like us. They are also constructed
out of different materials. Timber, glass-reinforced plastic, aluminium,
concrete (ferro), and steel are the main materials used to construct
a boat. They all have their advantage and disadvantages, they all
suit particular applications.
Most folks who come to buy a boat will only buy a boat that is a known
brand with a reliable resale value. No problem with that. But if the
price is right there is nothing wrong with buying the Taj Mahal on
water, even if it is painted pink. Another important point is understanding
something about the way, in which the boat industry has developed.
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Some Boat Industry Background |
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In Australia, it has
been in the past, very difficult to operate a profitable boat building
business. We simply have not had the economies of scale. The recession
in the early nineties wiped out a lot of small Australian boat builders.
That is why you are perhaps contemplating spending your hard earned
dollars on a 20 year old boat, which has had numerous owners, and
is not shining like a new pin.
However, it also means that your future pride and joy will probably
not loose value, and is some cases will actually increase in value.
Go and look for a 24-foot yacht only three years old, and apart from
some niche Australian makes, there are none. Unless you want to pay
for a new foreign import with a consequent high dollar value.
By now you should be getting the idea. Boat buying is more akin to
house buying than car purchasing-it is a fragmented small industry
which in some areas is still coming to terms with the rapidly changing
face of business, and the increase in boat ownership.
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At The Brokerage |
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Well you have finally
got to the marina, and are looking at the window display at the broker’s
office, wondering what sort of boat you would like.
If you want to go off-shore fishing or for a weekend away with the
family - a flybridge cruiser. For cruising around the Sydney harbour,
a sports cruiser would be great. If you are into sailing do you want
a full keel older style cruising yacht or a modern lightweight fin
keel yacht? You will be faced with a multitude of choices.
However for most of you the choice will be a fibreglass yacht or powerboat
under a hundred thousand dollars. This will mean a boat at least ten
years old with consequent apparent aging; some of you may prefer a
timber, steel, or even a concrete boat.
Why is fibreglass so popular? Fibreglass is a synthetic material,
which lasts longer than steel, timber or aluminium. As it is synthetic,
it is not continually trying to return to its natural state, i.e.
steel will rust, as it try’s to return to its ore state, timber will
rot, and aluminium will oxidize. Fibreglass is not only popular because
it is long lasting, but also because it lends itself to mass production.
A mould is made which can then replicate the original design many
times. Highly skilled labour is not required to lay fibreglass. Whereas
timber construction requires craftsman. Skilled welders weld steel.
Aluminium is expensive, and prone to variations in weld quality due
to atmospheric conditions.
Does this mean you should only buy a fibreglass boat? Not at all.
There are a lot of good steel, timber etc boats, that at the right
price are excellent value.
Usually, you end up buying the boat you fall in love with.
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Steel Boats |
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Steel boats are most
commonly built to be able to withstand hitting large immovable objects
such as rocks, seabeds, or even quietly snoozing submarines. Yacht
owners who intend to sail in waters they are not sure of favour them.
Steel is easy to repair, but does have a maintenance factor in that
the steel has to be well protected from the ravages of salt and water.
Steel can be prone to electrolysis, which is a reaction to all the
different metals in the boat, galvanised by the action of the water.
A common earthing system with sacrificial anodes (metal blocks bolted
to the hull, which are allowed to corrode, and are regularly replaced)
needs to be well-maintained in order to prevent excessive thinning
of the steel.
All steel boats rust, so do not be put off by initial appearances,
it may only be surface rust. You need to be concerned about the rust
you cannot see. Never buy a steel boat without an out of water inspection
by a qualified surveyor.
Plate thickness below the waterline, which has been reduced by corrosion,
is normally easily repaired. It is severe structural corrosion inside
the boat, which may be prohibitively expensive to repair- unless of
course the price of the boat takes this into account. Steel boats
are excellent for passage making / offshore cruising and should not
be discounted because of non-structural rust.
When buying a steel boat always insist on an ultra-sound by a professional
company. It is very difficult to assess structural corrosion without
such a test. It will give you a report detailing the thickness of
the steel plate over the under water area. However, if you do find
a reduction in steel thickness do not walk away from the sale, the
beauty of steel is the ease of repair. Get a quote for the repair
from a qualified welding company and, if necessary, renegotiate the
sale price. Unless of course the price has already taken the corrosion
into account .The other significant factor is the quality of the welds.
Unfortunately steel boats are sometimes amateur built using incorrect
welding techniques.
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Timber Boats |
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Timber is in theory
the best material of all, it is a natural insulator, and has an excellent
buoyancy factor. Timber boats normally exude loads of character, which
can be very seductive. However, you will have to paint and varnish
on a regular basis, but this can also be very relaxing - an option
to the garden shed!
I would not be too concerned about minor rot above the waterline.
But rot to structural members below the waterline may reduce your
bank manager to tears, or at least cause hysterical laughter at the
bank call centre, as they place you on hold to reassess your rapidly
diminishing credit rating. Be careful of marine ply/timber boats,
in good condition they are fine, but can be costly and difficult to
repair if affected by extensive rot.
But there are some great timber boats about, which offer better value
than fibreglass or steel. We never seem to have any trouble selling
carefully restored timber boats or those with defects being offered
at realistic prices.
Timber boats have a particular following, and as the price of new
boats increases, and consequently so does their second-hand value,
then the older timber boats will become more popular. A timber boat
is a pure joy to own. A timber boat has a style that fibreglass cannot
replicate and a uniqueness that cannot be copied by mass production
methods.
I love timber boats, and have two timber yachts of my own but I am also aware of the maintenance factor.
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Aluminium Boats |
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Aluminium is becoming
more popular, particularly in powerboats. Its advantages are its lightness,
and forming qualities, which can produce a good looking boat. The
temper of aluminium changes as a material hardens over time. This
causes fatigue which manifests itself as small cracks, particularly
around weld areas. Aluminium can also be badly affected by electrolysis,
more so than steel. Your surveyor will highlight any problems in this
area. Another area of concern is that any paint applied to aluminium
must use an etch primer (undercoat). If not applied correctly the
paint will not adhere to the aluminium, allowing corrosion to rapidly
develop.
It is doubtful if aluminium will ever become as common as fibreglass
as it is very labour intensive to manufacture. Note: Sacrificial anodes
are as important on aluminium boats as they are on steel. However,
aluminium boats will always have a following from owners who want
lightness and speed. Amateur builders do not generally carry out aluminium
welding. However, for smaller production boats, which can be mass-produced
aluminium is cost effective.
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Fibreglass Boats |
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Fibreglass is king
when it comes to popularity. Low-maintenance and light. The first
fibreglass boats were built in the 1940's. Despite its popularity
as a boatbuilding material it does age. Osmosis, stress cracks, and
faded gel coat will be evident in most fibreglass boats over ten years
old.
Stress cracks will always appear in highly loaded areas particularly
on yachts which have been continuously raced. Expect it, and learn
to live with it. Flexing of the gel coat causes it.
Gel coat? Well, fibreglass is a mixture of glass strand and a resin,
which bonds the strands together. To obtain the smooth finish that
you see on fibreglass boats, a thin layer of gel coat is added with
a colouring pigment- this gives fibreglass its colour. Because the
gel coat layer is quite thin, hairline cracks can appear in high stress
areas. Loss of colour due to the affect of ultra-violet rays can make
the fibreglass look very aged. A good gel coat restorer will restore
the gel coat to a high gloss finish.
Fibreglass boats do suffer from a form of water damage, known as osmosis.
This is the ingress of water into the fibreglass forming a bubble,
and in the extreme a delaminating of the fibreglass. The water is
allowed in by a defective manufacturing process, and it then expands
into the gel coat.
One theory is that the 1973-4 Arab oil embargo, which dramatically
increased the price of oil, and therefore the price of resins and
plastics, forced manufacturers to look for less expensive materials.
Osmosis is therefore normally related to an assembly process defect.
However, it is easily repaired, and an accepted fact of life as fibreglass
has become the most common construction material. It manifests as
a bubble or series of bubbles which when burst let out styrene fluids.
In its worst form the whole hull can be covered. Most boats have a
few bubbles, which can be ground out and epoxied. Normally the repair
may need to be repeated every 2 or 3 years until the worst of the
moisture is removed from the hull. There is another less serious form,
which can occur when an antifouling coating is applied to a very moisture
laden hull, and what looks like very small osmosis bubbles, is in
fact only water trapped in the antifoul layers. Very serious osmosis
can result in the whole gel coat having to be removed; this form of
osmosis should be carefully priced. Severe structural damage because
of osmosis is very rare. If it is evident, be wary of proceeding with
the sale until a professional repair quotation is obtained.
Fibreglass boats also have timber/ply bulkheads and structural members.
Your surveyor should check these are not water-damaged. Foam sandwich
construction is a favoured construction method of boat builders who
want to produce a fast light boat. Your surveyor should ensure that
the adhesive bonding is not faulty or damaged.
Fibreglass is not painted to provide colour. The colour is put in
as a gel when the fibreglass is laid. Therefore, as it fades, the
only alternative is to respray the whole boat, or if it is not too
bad repolish it. Painting can be quite expensive, and will require
regular maintenance, particularly if the deck is painted.
If it is sprayed using a "two pack" polyurethane paint then it will
increase the value of an older boat. Hand painting a fibreglass boat
can reduce its value if not carried out correctly. But if the price
is right do not let it put you off what otherwise may be a good boat.
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Ferro Boats |
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Concrete to the rest
of the world. A special grade of marine cement which is laid on a
steel framework. Usually built in a back garden, and the source of
much amusement to the neighbours as the builder realises it will no
longer fit his drive and has to be craned out of the back garden.
Ferro is either excellent or in the 'not to be touched with a garden
pole' class. A well-built ferro boat is normally excellent value for
money, as they do not attract the higher prices of fibreglass or steel.
An inspection by a qualified surveyor is a must for any ferro boat,
unless you work for Boral! Ferro boats, like timber boats can be excellent
value for money. A well-built Ferro boat can provide as much enjoyment
as a fibreglass equivalent, and cost you a lot less.
But be careful it is easy to hide a bad repair. A ferro boat consists
of a steel hull structure around which cement is laid, no different
to a building structure. If it professionally built the steel would
have been galvanized and welded areas treated with a protected paint.
Cement then has to be laid in the same time frame to ensure conformity
of strength. But don’t be put off there are plenty of ferro yachts
that have sailed around the world, -just buy carefully. As for a ferro
powerboat, I have never seen one, but I’m sure there is one somewhere!
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Engines |
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Diesel Yachts
vs. Petrol Yachts
Most yachts over 25’ have in-board diesel's, below that, they normally
have outboard’s. Inboard diesels will provide a more reliable form
of propulsion offshore (the propeller is usually further in the water
than that of an outboard), a better electrical system, and are difficult
to steal. However, an outboard is cheaper to maintain, and can give
you more room inside the boat. When buying a yacht up to 25 feet,
you are generally speaking, going to find that 80% have outboards.
Outboards are much cheaper to maintain than diesel inboards. With
an outboard you simply undo it and take it to the mechanic. On most
yachts $2,000 will buy you a four stroke outboard, whilst it can cost
up to $10,000 to replace an inboard. A four-stroke outboard is far
more reliable than a two stroke. They are more environmentally friendly,
use unleaded fuel, and are quieter. Unfortunately they are heavier
and more expensive than two-stroke outboards.
Over 25’ yachts are normally fitted with inboard diesels. Diesel engines
are compression ignition engines which to ensure reliability require
regular fuel filter changes and good batteries to ensure easy starting.
If you buy a diesel powered boat is a good investment to immediately
change the fuel filters and if possible clean out the fuel tank. Diesel
injection pumps have tolerance in microns and require clean fuel to
be reliable. A lot can be assessed on a diesel engine just by looking
and listening. Blue, black, and white smoke in abundance indicate
excessive oil consumption, excessive fuel delivery/restricted air
supply/shortage of air, and incomplete combustion-your survey will
check all these indicators.
Petrol Power Boats Vs Diesel
Power Boats
The majority of boats under 30’ will be petrol. There is nothing wrong
with petrol, as long as it is maintained correctly. It will give you
more speed, and is quieter. Above 30’ for a sedan, or flybridge boat,
diesel is more common. On sports boats diesel is normally fitted to
40' boats and above. Both have good and bad points, and both require
regular maintenance. Potential buyers often ask me how many hours
an engine has completed. Unless the boat is 0-4 years old I do not
think that is a question that should be asked. It would be better
to ask about the condition of the engine. I have never yet seen a
marine engine worn out, lack of use causes more problems, and can
result in excessive internal corrosion. The same wear indicators I
described in the yacht section above apply to all diesel engines.
The cooling system on any type of engine is particularly prone to
blockage from coral growth, and sediment build-up. You will hear the
term riser's and manifolds. The risers are part of the exhaust/cooling
system and are an item, which need to be checked/replaced, every 5
years-again depending on use. Your broker should be able to advise
you if the owner has invoices to verify their condition.
The advantages and disadvantages of petrol Vs diesel are fairly balanced.
Petrol engines are smoother, quieter, cost less initially, and faster.
Later petrol engines are fitted with electronic fuel infection systems,
which increases their reliability. Diesel engines do not have an open
fuel system, or an electrical ignition system, but are heavier, nosier,
and smoky at start up. Both have their good and bad. A lot depends
on what you intend to use the boat for.
Stern Drives
& Shaft Drives - The Driveline!
Powerboats have gearboxes, which are either mounted inside the boats
on the back of the engines, or bolted to the rear of the boat (transom).
Generally speaking powerboats below thirty feet will have the gearbox
in the water, this is known as a stern drive. The majority of mechanics
if asked will tell you that it is better to have a shaft drive boat.
This is only because they are continually repairing stern drives,
which have been badly maintained. A regularly serviced stern drive
leg is reliable and trouble free. However, every year it should be
removed and items such as the rubber bellows which keeps water away
from the shaft drive should be replaced, the gear box oil should also
be renewed. Your surveyor when examining the leg should always check
for water in the gearbox oil. When carrying out the test drive he
should be listening for excessive bearing noise. Driving the boat
on full lock and assessing bearing vibration should check the universal
joints, which allow the leg to turn through almost 180 degrees.
If the boat is not going to be used for long periods, a good tip for
stern drives with water intakes in the leg, is to put a set of rubber
outboard ears over the intakes. This will prevent coral growth inside
the leg. Shaft drives must be checked for engine misalignment excessive
gland wear and out of true shafts. These principles also apply to
yachts.
Engines and drivelines can, particularly on powerboats be very expensive
to repair. However, be wary of being too critical and losing a good
boat because of an over-zealous inspection-take some time out to understand
any reported defects. I have seen buyers reject a boat because of
an overrated defect, only to find their next attempted purchase has
much the same problems.
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Electrics |
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Common sense applies
to the majority of boat electrics. If it looks a total mess then ensure
that it is not just old wiring that has not been removed. Ensure your
surveyor is qualified to check any 240-volt equipment that is fitted.
Most boats will have a sounder and a radio. Do not get too hung up
on electrics, as modern systems are getting cheaper all the time,
and you will not need a GPS in the Harbour-even though it is a good
gadget to impress your friends with!
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LPG |
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Gas cooking/heating
systems should comply with NSW Workcover regulations, and be fitted
with a compliance plate.
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Rigging - Yachts |
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Definitely a black
art this one. Most standing rigging on yachts is of stainless steel.
However, stainless steel can be rust affected by lack of air circulation,
deformed, fatigued, and stressed-sounds like a day at the office!
Your surveyor will advise accordingly. However, some surveyor's do
not seem to take into account how stressed the rigging has been in
the past, and automatically condemn every rig. That’s all very well,
but a yacht that has never seen a race day, or been outside the Heads,
is not going to have been subject to the same stresses and strains
as one that has. If you are looking at your budget being blown away
because the surveyor has said the rig needs replacing then ask him
to explain why.
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Trailer Boats |
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The majority of boats
we sell are kept on the water. However, we do sell some trailer powerboats
and yachts. Always check the trailer as well as the boat. You do not
want the wheels falling off highway up the expressway. Continual immersion
in salt water will eventually corrode the wheel bearings. Remove the
wheel bearings once a year, clean them with a good degreaser, and
then repack them with marine bearing grease. They are normally taper
roller bearings so ensure that you refit them with the correct amount
of free play- and always fit a new stainless split pin. The larger
2 stroke outboards can be very expensive to repair-always ask a mechanic
to check the engine for you-including a compression check.
With trailer yachts check the swing or lift keel carefully-particularly
if the yacht has been moored for a while-it may be seized.
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Boat Share |
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A
relatively new concept. For some people boating is seen as a day out
rather than a lifestyle. It is possible to buy a share in a new boat. For further details email us at sales@sydneyboats.com.au.
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New Boats |
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We sell new Cranchi Powerboats. Obviously I think they are the
best in the world - go to our web site
http://www.sydneyboats.com.au
or go www.cranchi.it and
make up your own mind.
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What Makes A Good Boat? |
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Well, as I have found
out from my experience, every boat has a buyer. Some boats sell quickly,
others may take a while.
Be realistic, a boat for $30,000 that is 20 years old is not a new
boat. A hostile environment continually surrounds boats. Take the
overall condition into consideration, do not highlight a particular
defect and reject the boat, when the rest of her may be very good.
When it comes to choosing your boat, cheap is not always best. It
may cost you the purchase price again in repairs. First of all, start
with the realisation that when you spend a lot of money for a used
boat, you’re not going to be happy with an expensive, but well-worn
cast off. You’ll not only want to bring back some of the shine, but
assure some reliability too. You want to feel good about your purchase,
and to do that you have to spend more than just the purchase price.
In other words, the price is only part of the cost.
When evaluating a budget for a used boat, think of price in terms
of what a new boat costs, for this puts the matter of cost in its
proper perspective. Older boats will require some work. Therefore,
take this into account when you are doing your sums.
Ok, you have found a boat you like, so what next?
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The Buying Process |
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The Offer
This can be difficult, but if the broker has done his job you will
know a little bit more about the boat than just its colour. It is
the broker’s job to get the best possible price for the boat, so do
not expect him to push the price down for you. He will play his part
for you when discussing your offer with the owner. He should discuss
your offer with the owner, and negotiate on his behalf. If your offer
is accepted you will be asked to place a deposit. The broker should
give you a deposit receipt, which details the conditions of the deposit.
These are normally:
- Subject to a satisfactory survey
- A settlement date
- Other conditions, as negotiated
The broker should also confirm the acceptance of the offer in writing
to the owner of the vessel.
Once your offer has been accepted the broker should not accept any
other offers on the vessel, unless the survey is unsatisfactory and
you decide not to go ahead.
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Test Drives
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We do not normally
allow test-drives until a deposit is placed. As you can imagine we
show a lot of boats to a lot of people. So it is not practical to
test drive used boats unless a deposit is placed, then we know the
buyer is serious.
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Finance
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Finance-most finance
companies will want to see a survey on an older boat. Generally speaking
finance companies are quite happy to lend on a boat. We use BIA Marine
Finance; they can be contacted on 02 9843 7000. It is much better to
arrange your finance before putting an offer on a boat, as if your
finance application is rejected after you have placed your deposit
you can lose your deposit.
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Other Costs
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Here are some average
costs:
- Insurance - 24' = $400, 30' = $5-600, 38' = $800-$1200 per year
- Mooring Costs (Waterways) = $400-$600 per year
- Marina Mooring = $10/foot per month
- Berth Costs = $24/foot per month
- Yearly Anti-foul - 24' = $1000, 30' = $1000min
- Maintenance - single engine inboard = $1000/year
- Laying a Mooring = $900
- Mooring Service = $300
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The Survey
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It is a good idea
to get a survey. Some boats may come with a survey, but this is rare.
Older boats will not get insurance cover without a survey. Survey
costs (an inspection by a qualified marine professional), are about
$22 per foot of length. Some surveyors only inspect the structure
of the boat; some do the boat and the engine; ask for our surveyor’s
list. Surveyors will try to price repairs or improvements for you,
always get a second opinion.
It is difficult to be critical of surveyors because as a broker my
job is to sell the boat, and my opinion can be seen as being bias.
However, at times I do question the opinion of surveyors if I feel
that their report is not justified. It is not the job of the surveyor
to negotiate price, nor is he there to compare a used boat that is
20 years old to a new one. He should give you an impartial report,
which he is prepared to justify and not walk off in huff if he is
asked to explain his findings!
The majority of surveyors are realistic and carry out a very through
inspection, but there are a few who are doom gloom merchants-these
purveyors of doom seem to take great delight in assessing the boat
as a new one. However, if you discuss their report with a broker present
or your own expert, they will under pressure or extreme torture admit
the boat is representative of its year. Always insist on being present
for the survey, and treat it as a learning experience. When possible
we try to arrange the test drive with the surveyor. If the survey
result is worse than expected, then we will renegotiate the price
for you. You must always remember you are not buying a new boat. It
is not realistic to expect the owner to give you an as-new boat, unless
of course the price justifies it.
If the result is not satisfactory, and an alternative price / repair
cannot be negotiated, then you get your deposit back minus any costs.
The notes below are those which we give to
potential buyers.
SURVEYORS & MECHANICAL ASSESSORS
When reading a surveyors
report the age and the price offered for the boat are important
factors to consider. You can’t expect a twenty-year-old boat to be as
new and without fault. When a boat is surveyed the surveyor will
identify some problems that are cosmetic or easily rectifiable and
others that will need attention immediately. You also have to take
into account that surveyors are employed to find every fault or
defect. You cannot expect an owner to repair faults that are common
for the age of boat. It all comes down to price and expectations. Do
not expect a vessel which normally sells for $x and is being sold for
$x – a lot to be in great condition. Older boats have to be
refurbished and each owner will be involved in some form of
refurbishment.
Some
common issues on older boats are:
Yachts
Rigging
– if the age of rigging cannot be proven then some surveyors
will tell you it needs replacing. That is a fair comment. But if an
owner has been using the yacht with the existing rigging then it is
difficult to negotiate the replacement of the rigging.
Osmosis:
Most older yachts will have osmosis. These days it is easily repaired.
It is excessive osmosis that is of serious concern.
Chainplate flexing
causing deck movement. This is common on older yachts. The security of
the chainplates is the concern not the deck flexing.
Bolt On Keel to hull Flexing
– Common, as long as it is not excessive.
Power
Boats
Osmosis
–
see above
Risers and manifolds -
these cause the greatest problems, A
surveyor will take a power boat out for a run. It will perform well,
it will not overheat but he will say they need replacing as they are 4
years old. Always a difficult one so be prepared for an owner who will
not negotiate on the basis that it is running fine. The best way is to
enquire before making your offer and then take the answer into account
when you make your offer.
Heat exchanger-
If there is no documentation to show a service in the last 2 years and
even if they are performing well and not causing temperature creep the
surveyor may suggest the heat exchanger's) need servicing. Again it is
difficult to negotiate on an item that is performing correctly.
Leg Drive shaft Bellows.
Many surveyors’ will suggest these should be replaced if there is not
documentation to say they have been changed in the last 2 years. It is
good advice but again it can cause a problem at negotiation as an
owner may say that the bellows are fine and not causing a problem. The
same will apply to shift cable bellows.
The
above items are those which unless clearly understood can result in
you not buying a yacht or powerboat which is basically sound. Take the
time to understand the above terms. Surveyors are professionals who
are being employed by you to find problems. However they sometimes do
not take into the account the purchase price and the fact that some of
the defects found can be expected for the price being paid. At the end
of the day sensible negotiation should prevail. A satisfactory outcome
is normally attained with 99% of our sales.
Take the time to
understand the surveyors report. Often we are negotiating after survey
with buyers who do not really understand the surveyors report. Take
the time to read the report carefully so you can get an overall view
of the vessel you are buying. It is all too easy to reject a boat only
to find that the next one is the same and it has cost you another
survey to find out. A good broker will have driven the boat and should
be able to give you some sort of service history.
If the survey is not
satisfactory it’s usually worth discussing the areas of concern with
the surveyor and the broker together as often problems can be solved
by re-negotiating with the owner.
The
above comments are based on several years of selling yachts and
powerboats. They are not set in tablets of stone and you may take them
with a pinch of salt – after all we are selling the boat. However they
are points you should be at least aware of. Boating is great fun but a
boat is not a car. Boats experience harsh conditions and do not always
gleam like a new pin and we sometimes do not see faults in the same
light as those who have never experienced them before. If you are not
sure about the meaning of some of the technical terms pleas do not
hesitate to ask we are more than happy to explain the significance of
the terms used above.
Surveyors can also be found in the Yellow pages under the heading
‘Marine Surveyors’
Marine Surveyors:
Steve
Booth 0418 622 455
Richard Partridge
0416
210 660
Sandy
Schofield 0412 244 908
Phil
Pilcher 0408 221 735
Weaver
Marine 0402 485 328
David
Copley 4446 4660
P & F
Kershaw 0427 990
446
Gavin
Clarke 0418 442 515
Marine
Assess 93680277
David
Holmes 0412 918 289
Peter
Burge 0425 249 709
Warwick
Thomson 0409 243 328
Both
Boat & Engine:
Alain
Francqueville 0409 999 344
Peter
Kysil 0408 289 600
Engine
Assessors:
Jason Bott 0418 427 474
Bill Lacey 9997 6106
If you are unsure of
which surveyor to engage it often helps by speaking with a couple of
surveyors and seeing whom you feel comfortable with. If possible you
should be present at the survey, ask whatever questions you wish,
remember you are paying the surveyor for his professional assessment
of your proposed investment.
Sydney Boat
Sales and its employees do not recommend surveyors, do not contract
surveyors for you, are not responsible for your decision to buy the
boat based on your surveyor’s report, or any defects not noted by the
surveyor.
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The Slipping
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This allows the boat
to be pulled out of the water so the under water inspection can be
carried out.
Slipping costs - this will allow the surveyor to inspect the boat
out of the water- $9 per foot of length (can vary). Try and find out
from the broker what he/she thinks of the boat. There is no point
in slipping a boat if there are known defects, which may be irreparable,
or prohibitively expensive. However, when we list a boat we try to
assess it, but we are not always fully aware of the total condition,
so always be prepared for the unexpected. At the end of the day sensible
negotiation should prevail.
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Moorings
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Public moorings are
available from Waterways; Waterways are generally speaking very helpful,
ask them for the mooring waiting list. Waterways Sydney can be contacted
on 95638511. It is not always possible to get a mooring in the area
you want. If this is the case you may want to use a marina mooring,
until a mooring is available in the area that you want. You will not
be able to get a mooring without a boat.
If you do obtain a Waterways mooring you may have to lay a mooring.
This involves a Waterways Officer taking you to the area where your
mooring will be and providing you with a map marking the position
of the mooring. You will then give the map to the Mooring Contractor.
He will lay the mooring for you. Moorings are not transferable if
you sell your boat and do not buy another all you can do is ask Waterways
to let the ask the next user of the mooring if he wants to buy the
block and tackle from you. Moorings have to be serviced once a year.
Particularly where they are sited on busy waterways, as the chain
and shackle will wear out due to constant movement. Call Gladesville
Bridge Marina for a quote on laying a mooring on 91812014.
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Marina Moorings
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Call Gladesville
Bridge Marina 02 9181 2014 for a mooring quote. Marina moorings can
act as a stopgap whilst you wait for the mooring of your choice to
be allocated.
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Documentation
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We provide you with
all the paperwork necessary to register the boat in your name.
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Encumbrances
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We also provide you
with a certificate, showing that there are no monies owed on the boat.
This is obtained from the NSW office of Fair Trading- not always possible
from other states. We also obtain a statutory declaration from the
owner's stating that they own the boat and are selling it with full
title.
If there are monies owed on the boat then we will organise payment
on behalf of the owner.
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National Boat Registration
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If the boat is Australian
ship registered then an encumbrance check can be obtained from the
Australian Maritime office. Normally only boats that are capable of
passage making are Australian registered.
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Ownership
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In NSW registration
papers are not proof of ownership, that is why it is necessary to
obtain a statutory declaration from the owner confirming title. Title
is passed to you by the signing of the ‘Bill of Sale’.
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The Big Day
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This can be a bit
nerve wracking. You have been through a fast learning curve, it is
finally at an end, and you now own a boat. The broker will ensure
that the boat is as you inspected it. If you have never driven a boat
before then get some lessons-your broker will advise of suitable persons
who can help in that area. Ensure the broker has given all the documentation
necessary to register the boat in your name, the keys, and of course-the
boat.
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What next? |
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Boating is great fun,
but to ensure you fully enjoy your experiences on the water, never
be afraid to ask questions.
It is a very different environment to that on land. A marine professional
will always be helpful and polite to those who admit the limitations
of their knowledge.
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After Sales Service |
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The majority of the
boating industry is professional and qualified. Unfortunately the
nature of our industry attracts people who are not necessarily fully
aware (working on boats would be fun!) of the specialist nature of
the work involved. Ask your broker whom he uses to carry out repairs.
I only recommend companies or individuals I have used myself. Try
and be explicit with your repair instructions. For mechanical repairs
always insist the repairer take the boat for a test drive after the
repairs are carried out.
With shipwright work it is better to break large repairs into a series
of small jobs; they are easier to cost.
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Safety - Be Prepared |
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whilst boating is great fun, you need to be fully aware of safety
procedures. A boat, particularly a powerboat is not the same as a
car. It is not wise to just jump on board start the engines and head
off at full power. Take the time to learn a little about your boat.
Always carry safety equipment, some tools, a torch and spare fuel.
A good fire extinguisher is a must on any boat. The boating world
is awash with stories about boat owners who go out completely unprepared,
and come back from their drama-ridden day a blubbering wreck, with
wife in tow heading for the divorce solicitors.
For a fee you can join Sea Tow - members get
free towing. I highly recommend their service - contact them on 02
91813777.
Preparation is a prerequisite for happy boating. The wind and sea
are no person's servants.
The final bit of advice is concerning resale. Keep all your receipts,
keep your boat, clean, tidy, and uncluttered. We all like to know
a little of the history of the boat. Particularly on older boats.
Well, that’s about it. There are books upon books on boat buying,
and a million more words of advice from your best mate who insists
you buy the same sort of boat he had, to the "expert", who knows everything.
All I know is that I love boating and wether you buy a boat for $2000
or $200,000, you will too.
If you are
buying a boat from an owner or broker and want some independent advice
you can always email me on
des@sydneyboats.com.au
Desmond Last
Sydney Boat Sales |
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